Who Has Murdered The Most: Atheists Or Christians ?
by Jack Hectorman
It isn't arguable. The “Murder, Torture, and Enslavement” award
goes to the Atheists and their atheistic ideology. Atheists have been
prolific, proficient and accomplished Murderers, Torturers, and
Enslavers and the historical records prove it true.

Christians have also Murdered, Tortured and Enslaved but never
remotely approaching the scope/scale of the Atheists.
Christians have murdered and tortured a (relatively) few “witches”
and heritics in the name of religious purity in centuries past, but
never in the tens of millions.
                                            
There was no god(s), God, or religion whatsoever connected with
Mao and his regime when some 30 to 40 million people were
murdered. Comrade Stalin too, and his regime, was without any
piety when he murdered between 20 and 60 million people in his
purges.

God, god(s) and religion had no part in any of this:

Communist China……………………35 million murdered
Germany (total 20th century)……..21 million murdered
Soviet Union (total 20th century)…62 million murdered
Stalinist Purges (1930-1938)……..20-60 million murdered
Cambodia (1975-1979)……………1-2 million murdered

Atheists and their atheistic ideology have murdered well
over 100,000,000 people in the 20th century, and they
did it all without reference to any god or religion.

(They were trying to “fix the world” or make the world
“better” according to their vision based on a non-religious
foundation, and they were willing to murder tens of millions
of human beings in order to achieve their non-religious
vision of a better world.”)

__Source: David Wallechinsky, The People's Almanac
Presents The Twentieth Century ( New York: Little, Brown,
and Company, 1995);
and “Statistics Of Democide,” By Rudy J. Rummel, as cited
in The Economist magazine.
Quoted by Julian L. Simon and Stephen Moore in It's Getting
Better All The Time: Greatest Trends Of The Last 100 Years,
page 16

Does this suggest that the Atheists that haunt threads on
the web, and their fellows Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris,
and Christopher Hitchens, etc are in the camp of Mao,
Pol Pot, and Stalin and bear equal quilt for the Murder,
Torture and Enslavement of whole peoples ? Of course
not, not any more than present day Christians bear guilt
for the crimes of Christians in past centuries.

Individual Atheists are no more guilty for the crimes committed
in the past from their camp, than are Christians guilty for the
crimes committed in the past from our camp. And if murder
in the tens of thousands is to be attached to Christians for
the actions of past Christians, then the logic is compelling:
Murders in the tens of millions is to be attached to Atheists
for the actions of their fellow Atheists in the 20th century.

The historical record demonstrates that the crimes against, murders of, torture of, and enslavement of peoples by Christians pale in comparison to the murders, torture, and enslavement of peoples by the Atheists and non-Christian world. The Roman Empire, the Aztecs, the Egyptian Empire, indeed all the ancient non-Christian nations and empires were characterized by brutal wars and the brutal subjugation of conquered peoples

It is estimated there were some 4,000,000 slaves in the South in 1861 but the vast majority were never murdered or tortured. Then too, Bill Clinton went to Africa and apologized for slavery.He apologized to the descendants of the African chiefs that sold their own people to the white slavers, but I never heard they apologized to him for the business practices of their fathers.

To anyone who believes the Christian bible, the Christian God holds the record for wholesale slaughter of humans and animals. Born more than one time crusader George Bush slaughtered many thousands of innocent humans in his two illegal crusades.

Hermit Dave wrote:To anyone who believes the Christian bible, the Christian God holds the record for wholesale slaughter of humans and animals. Born more than one time crusader George Bush slaughtered many thousands of innocent humans in his two illegal crusades.

_________
Reply:

Hermit, your "the Christian God holds the record for wholesale slaughter of humans and animals" is a mere assertion not supported by a single piece of evidence. The historical record contradicts your assertion. Mao alone slaughtered more humans (between 30 and 40 million)  than were slaughtered in ALL the wars recorded in the Bible. In Biblical times there were not population numbers even close to 30 or 40 million people living in the whole and entire lands of Canaan.

You also said that Bush conducted two "...illegal crusades..."

Reply:
Illegal as determined by who ?
(1) You ?
(2) The gang of criminals and thugs that make up a large portion of the so called "United" Nations ?
(3) The criminals and thugs that make up a large part of the so called International "Community" ?
(4) Alex Baldwin ?

___________
I note that you did not refute any points made in my post, instead you wrote an emotional response. The little devil cartoon emoticon in very cute, but it doesn't offer any hard evidence or even make one argument.

Best Regards,

Jack

WELL JACK---you left out the bible fact that God killed every living human and animal on earth except some guy named Noah and a bunch of animals on a boat. This was far more evil that all the evil humans put together.

As for the illegal Bush crusades, no civilized leader of a civilized country would bomb and kill innocent people in another country on the pretext of looking for one guy. Nor would they bomb and kill women and children just to try and get rid of a leader of a country.  Neither event was necessary, the CIA could have taken out both guys just like the did Allende in Chili.

Hermit Dave wrote:WELL JACK---you left out the bible fact that God killed every living human and animal on earth except some guy named Noah and a bunch of animals on a boat. This was far more evil that all the evil humans put together.

As for the illegal Bush crusades, no civilized leader of a civilized country would bomb and kill innocent people in another country on the pretext of looking for one guy. Nor would they bomb and kill women and children just to try and get rid of a leader of a country.  Neither event was necessary, the CIA could have taken out both guys just like the did Allende in Chili.

___________

Hello Hermit,

Reply:

Regarding your first paragraph above:

(1) I note for the record that you DO believe that God exist, and that the Bible is a TRUE historical record, since you cite as historical FACT an act of God recorded in the Bible in the book of Genesis. (Don't forget that you have stated your belief in the existence of God and in the TRUTH of the Bible. This will be useful in future discussions.)

(2) It is not evil for the Creator to destroy the people He has created since He owns all that He creates.

Moreover, when the people that He has created choose to totally corrupt themselves doing continual violent murder and every other evil known to man, as did the people God destroyed in the Great Flood, there is no evil done on the part of God in destroying them. It was perfect justice. Similiarly, when the state executes violent brutal murderers it does not there-by do evil, rather it does justice. Or if the state confines violent brutal murderers to life or 40 years in prison, it does not there-by do evil, rather it does justice.

You cannot demonstrate with facts and evidences that it is evil for God to destroy those He created, nor can you demonstrate with facts or evidences that the people He destroyed were not destroyed in perfect justice and deserved it fully.
________________

Regarding your second paragraph:
My challenge to you was to prove that Bush's war was "illegal." You said it was "illegal" and I asked you to prove it was illegal by citing someone or some orgo that has the authority to declare that it was an "illegal" war.

You ignored that challenge, and are now talking about it being "uncivilized." Btw, I do not know of any wars anywhere that were "civilized." Do you ? Was WW II civilized ?

One more thing, I take it that since you believe it is immoral to "...kill innocent people..."that it follows you also believe that the killing of innocent human babies in the wombs of their mothers is also a moral evil, right ?

You do say that abortion is a moral evil, do you not ? Since, human babies have been killed in the wombs of their mothers as old as 7 and 8 months (from conception). Abortion kills the innocent and is therefore a moral evil, right ?

WOW--JACK---This is so interesting, so what you are saying is the Christian god has the right to kill anything he makes. You use as an example humans that disobeyed him. Do you think all the humans he drowned were adults? What about the little kids? Did god give them a chance to do anything but tread water?

No you are correct war is not civilized. However unnecessary wars are even more uncivilized. Fake wars are worse than that.

Hermit Dave wrote:WOW--JACK---This is so interesting, so what you are saying is the Christian god has the right to kill anything he makes. You use as an example humans that disobeyed him. Do you think all the humans he drowned were adults? What about the little kids? Did god give them a chance to do anything but tread water?

No you are correct war is not civilized. However unnecessary wars are even more uncivilized. Fake wars are worse than that.

________________________
Hermit Dave,

Yes, I am saying that God has a right to kill anything He creates. I do not say that He will choose to exercise that right without good reason, but He absolutely has that right.

Then add to that the fact that all human beings have forfeited any and all claims on God's Justice because we are members of a fallen race. Doubt that ? Read the newspaper. Watch the nightly news. You will see a fallen race in action daily in the media. Read history books. We humans are a fallen race. Its a fact. It is what it is. Not a one of us can say to God, "You owe me." Not a one of us can claim that, "God has no right to kill me anytime He decides He wants to."

I am alive by pure mercy and grace. That is what I live on. I NEVER ask God for Justice. I wouldn't survive if He gave me Justice. I pray for mercy and grace for me and my family every day.

If you're 72 as you say, its time you gave some thought to asking God for some mercy and grace. There are only 120 months in ten years Dave.  And Time flies ! Where do ya think you'll be, say, a mere 240 months from today ?

Remember Dave, you're human and humans often think they're right when they're totally wrong. Suspose you're wrong about the Christian faith and the God of the Bible ?

There is such a thing as 11th hour conversions, it don't happen often because most of the Lord's children that are coming to Him come before they get as old as you are.

Thought For Today:
"...The words 'it was credited to him' were written not for him alone, but also for us, to whom God will credit righteousness---for us who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead. He was delivered over to death for our sins and was raised to life for our justification. Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ..."
     __Romans 4:23---5:1

I will be 76 on July 12th 2009. But I will never believe in a crazy god who kills humans because they fail  to worship him enough.

Hermit Dave wrote:I will be 76 on July 12th 2009. But I will never believe in a crazy god who kills humans because they fail  to worship him enough.

_________________
Reply:
(1) You are an disingenious poster Dave, who mfg. out of blue sky "straw men" designed to cloud the issues and provide you with a smoke screen behind which to hide. For example, the idea that God kills humans "because they fail to worship Him enough" has never been mentioned one time on these threads, nor by any sane Christian anywhere in the world at any time. That is a notion you just invented as a "straw man" with which to slam the Christian faith, seeing as how nobody in their right mind good believe in a God that kills humans "because they fail to worship Him enough."

(2) At some point you will believe in God and there isn't anything you can do to prevent it. Most likely by then it will not be the kind of belief that will do you any good.

Sad. Quite sad.

But then on the other hand ya got free will, don't ya Dave ?  You get to decide where you spend eternity.

Cheers.